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So you might have seen the title of this and thought: that’s a weird question for Brad to ask out of the blue.
It stemmed from this Guardian article that I read on Tuesday afternoon over what was meant to be a relaxing mid-afternoon cup of tea, intended to calm me down after I went on a massive rant on Monday.
It did exactly the opposite.
I confess I didn’t make it through the whole thing after several attempts—it just pissed me off too much.
I’ll give you a snippet as to why: it opens with a quote from a manager of a restaurant in South London. His name is mentioned to be Stephen “Boydie” Boyd, which annoyed me all on its own. But his explanation as to why he’s banned under tens from his restaurant really got to me. He said:
“There’s a level of expectation that the world fits around the kids, the kids don’t fit around the world.”
This is bullshit on an obscene amount of levels. Fair enough, it’s your restaurant so do with it what you please. But to say that parents expect the world to conform around their kids is totally not my experience.
Every time we take our kids anywhere public, whether it’s a restaurant, a coffee shop or even to some shops, it’s painfully obvious that the world isn’t made for people with young kids—and the world could not give less of a shit.
The amount of stuff we bring with us to a restaurant for a family gathering just to distract our three-year-old is ridiculous—colouring books, stuffed toys, fidget toys…and most of the time she ends the evening watching something on my phone anyway. Why do we do this? Because we’re so painfully, acutely aware of the damn stares—the ceaseless gaze of the permanently miserable, cynical adults who seem to frequent whatever restaurant we’ve dared to come to with our kids—probably the first time we’ve had a meal out of the house in six months or more. These types of people are typified by this quote from the article’s author:
Ultimately, the pro-kids side is probably outnumbered by the legion who like children in principle, but feel they have done their time at the coalface.
Imagine thinking being “at the coalface” is having a meal with no children at your table; no crayons, lidless felt tip pens or stickers strewn across your table, no constant demands and cries for attention—oh, but you have the unbearable misfortune to hear someone else’s kids in the same room as you.
Sure, if someone’s been there and done it with kids and are now left with an empty nest, of course they’re going to enjoy child-free time more often. But they can’t expect everyone else in society to militantly ensure that their kids don’t dare to make a sound in their general vicinity. Children are part of society too—like it or not.
No one’s asking these people to look after or entertain someone else’s kids—just to have a bit of sympathy with the parents who want nothing more than for their kids not to bother anyone else.
I feel like parents of young kids are constantly bending over backwards to make sure that we’re not perceived by these joyless wonders as “those parents” every time we deign to set foot outside our homes. We don’t want anything from these establishments, other than a bit of patience and for their awful patrons to mind their own damn business.
But no. Let’s ban kids from restaurants. Let’s let the people who have all the time and space in the world to fritter away in eateries and coffee shops have more, and the parents who just want a change of scenery for once in a while have less.
Ahem. Sorry, I may have slightly biased the debate here. But I am genuinely interested to hear your views here—am I missing some more complex part of this argument? Should there be more child-free spaces? The floor is (finally) yours.
This reminds me of plane debate that pops up every few years when some poorly thought out article is written about giving "goody bags" to others on the plane to apologize for flying with kids.
Every adult was once a child. Without children there is no future for society. How exactly do we teach kids the proper was to behave in society if we ban them from participating?
As for the goody bags on planes. Why should I apologize? We are the ones traveling for the better part of a day with toddlers in tow to go to a funeral or family function. If I could avoid the plane, I would. Sometimes it just is not possible.
Final point. You are correct on the world not revolving around kids. I have noticed this is especially true for my wife. I get a pass, generally speaking. She gets the dirty looks.
🙌 When my grandfather was still alive, twice a year we would fly 8 hrs with 2 kids under 6 to go visit. (We would barely recover before it was time to go home...) Luckily we never had any issues, but a screaming baby is only made worse when you feel so self-conscious about what's happening.
As the father of two girls who frequents restaurants with them - and gets a lot of joy out of it - I think that restaurants should be able to do what they want when it comes to allowing kids. There are lines - I’m not sure where exactly they are and it may shift depending on the type of place - where kids shouldn’t have the same experiences as adults. Kids are not little adults.
If I’m out with just my wife celebrating an anniversary and there’s a family next to us with kids (likely on devices) with the volume up, I don’t think that restaurant will get my business again for that type of meal.
Same goes with dogs in restaurants for that matter. And ironically I think that statement will draw more heat than saying kids shouldn’t be allowed in certain restaurants.
Although they sometimes scream so loud I can't hear my thoughts, I'm not bothered by sitting next to families with small children in the restaurants. I believe we should let them have fun, experience eating in restaurants early and not ban kids from most of them, yet I think it should be decided by that place's owner(s).
This reminds me of plane debate that pops up every few years when some poorly thought out article is written about giving "goody bags" to others on the plane to apologize for flying with kids.
Every adult was once a child. Without children there is no future for society. How exactly do we teach kids the proper was to behave in society if we ban them from participating?
As for the goody bags on planes. Why should I apologize? We are the ones traveling for the better part of a day with toddlers in tow to go to a funeral or family function. If I could avoid the plane, I would. Sometimes it just is not possible.
Final point. You are correct on the world not revolving around kids. I have noticed this is especially true for my wife. I get a pass, generally speaking. She gets the dirty looks.
🙌 When my grandfather was still alive, twice a year we would fly 8 hrs with 2 kids under 6 to go visit. (We would barely recover before it was time to go home...) Luckily we never had any issues, but a screaming baby is only made worse when you feel so self-conscious about what's happening.
As the father of two girls who frequents restaurants with them - and gets a lot of joy out of it - I think that restaurants should be able to do what they want when it comes to allowing kids. There are lines - I’m not sure where exactly they are and it may shift depending on the type of place - where kids shouldn’t have the same experiences as adults. Kids are not little adults.
If I’m out with just my wife celebrating an anniversary and there’s a family next to us with kids (likely on devices) with the volume up, I don’t think that restaurant will get my business again for that type of meal.
Same goes with dogs in restaurants for that matter. And ironically I think that statement will draw more heat than saying kids shouldn’t be allowed in certain restaurants.
Although they sometimes scream so loud I can't hear my thoughts, I'm not bothered by sitting next to families with small children in the restaurants. I believe we should let them have fun, experience eating in restaurants early and not ban kids from most of them, yet I think it should be decided by that place's owner(s).